CCR 014: GM Babies are Here

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GENETICALLY MODIFIED BABIES ARE HERE! Basil and Gonz are back. They discuss the latest reports that the first GM (Genetically Modified) babies have been born and declassified. While the technology is presented as a positive alternative to folks who are having trouble conceiving, the long term effects and potential ethical issues being ignored are alarming. The guys discuss these things and more as it pertains to the times we are living in, and why the promise of Jesus Christ is the answer.

LINKS

GM Babies: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-43767/Worlds-GM-babies-born.html

Is the Antichrist Pro-Life, Pro-Choice, or Both?: http://www.facelikethesun.com/2012/06/29/is-the-antichrist-pro-life-pro-choice-or-both/ 

29 comments… add one
  1. Arnn

    Sheesh what’s it been—three weeks? Yous’e guys musta been on vacation. Glad you fellers are back—I’m pluggin’ in the Ipod now.

  2. Blessings, greetings & welcome back! A) What a violation of free will, at an embryonic level. B)Loss of genetic diversity = vulnerability to future diseases and adverse events. C) This is a contravention of the plan God has for each individual’s life/salvation. D) Eugenics for sure … E) Oh the potential for unintended consequences!

  3. Hey guys, great to see you back up!

    I often think and talk about genetic modification. It’s still a very murky area, I’m sure we will all see some very interesting developments in our lives.

    I’m not sure how I feel about modifications to things like strength and intelligence, but I struggle to view that altering someone’s DNA to prevent a serious disease or defect that would adversely affect their life as a bad thing.

    Anyway, there is a potential for some radical creatures to be spawned and by all means I’m sure black-labs have already carried out such experiments. I remember reading about here in the UK some stem cells were crossed with cow’s, but I can’t remember exactly why. I think they got round it by terminating the embreyos after a certain time period.

    I remember watching a lecture on DNA and on how our bodies do not operate at ‘%100’. Essentially the argument was that the efficiency of our bodies was as good as developing conditions allow, so why wouldn’t we increase our strength, the resilience of our organs or the efficacy of their functions? It’s a compelling argument and it’s one that I find trouble deciding on myself.

    I really think that this science only progresses so far before it’s buffered by public perception, which, is easily manipulated by the media. There is an ongoing debate about stemcells ect.. We have a strong anti GM sentiment in the UK, I feel is being eroded.

    1. admin

      It’ll be a slow indoctrination. Again, being presented as a way to provide children to the barren, or help genetically modify out diseases etc. But there will be a tipping point. Just as plastic surgery went from something that was to help the deformed to being accepted as used for enhancement. It will be slow, but it will happen.

      -gonz

  4. Arnn

    That was nice of you guys to give a shout out to the listeners!
    I listen to a lot of talk radio—much of it cerebral, and I consider you guys one of the best. Your show is on my google chrome most visited and some days I’ll click the site several times to see if you’ve posted a new show.

    Happy 4th

    Arnn

    1. Yeah it was really nice. 🙂 We all appreciate the effort you guys go to make these pod casts a lot I’m sure.

      Arn, why not subscribe to the mailing list so you get an email when a new show is uploaded?

      1. Arnn

        Hiya Jonny,

        I think I am on the mailing list—I definitely signed up for “The Chirp” (love that name). It’s kinda fun to click on the webpage and see if there are any additional comments and or new shows—sort of like playing the slot machine. Plus I’ve been straying away from my old AOL email account even though I’ve had it for 10+ years–just in the last year it’s been getting a lot of spam and AOL keeps changing the format.

        Best,

        Arnn

  5. E

    It’s old news. I think comments still apply, though. We’re just that much further along.

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn712-gm-babies.html

    http://archives.cnn.com/2001/TECH/science/05/05/US.genes/

    1. admin

      Interesting find. I find it strange that the New Scientist article echoes almost identically the article we quote. Something smells fishy. Same dr (Dr. Jacques Cohen) same Institute (Reproductive Medicine and Science of Saint Barnabas in New Jersey) same report of having a 1 year old child with DNA from three parents.

      Now why would the DailyMail UK just two weeks ago, repost an article that was written over a decade ago with the same information?

      This means that the 1 year old, is actually 10 or 11 years old. What is going on?

      -Gonz

  6. Brad

    I thought for sure Bas and Gonz got captured by the elite..

    another great show!

    1. admin

      Not quite. Although I’m sure they’re after us. I’m sure we’re all on the “s” list 🙂

      -Gonz

      1. Brad

        Gonz, several shows ago you mentioned a film you were working on in regards to the doctrines of hell, anything new on that? Sorry if you have talked more about it. I listen to the podcast at work so I do get interupted at times. Age of Deceite was fantastic.

        1. admin

          It’s sort of on the back burner at the moment. I have a script written but I usually re-write them at least two or three times before I feel comfortable moving forward with it.

          Working on Doug Hamps movie has taken over for the time being.

          The other problem is that making a video about hell is not as easy as I thought it would be. It’s a huge topic and has a lot of malleable parts, different views etc. I want to really be thorough with it so I can provide the most objective and grounded answer to the doctrine of hell. I can riff on the theology but it’s a whole different game when it’s time to make a video about it.

          I will get it done at some point. Thanks for asking about it.

          -Gonz

  7. Roman

    Great to have you guys back. Great info once again.

  8. Arnn

    When I saw the title to the show I thought that the U.S. Government used the GM (General Motors)bailout money to create Frankensteinian babies rather than cars. Hee Hee!

  9. I confess that the part of the whole genetic manipulation issue that still gives my brain a cramp, is when you start wondering about the possible demonic/”nephilim” connections…

    I mean, it seems pretty straight forward that we shouldn’t be fooling around with trying to “fix” our DNA, cuz in the very least there could be some seriously crappy side effects down the line. But I guess it’s still a little hard for me to wrap my head around the thought that it would really only take the right reconfiguration of necleotides in order to create “demonic DNA”… I’m not saying I think it’s a silly idea, (there are sure of things that point to such a reality), but I suppose it’s just that when I imagine how the “Watchers” created the Nephilim by mating with human women, it just seems like maybe that genetic “union” had to involve more than just the typical combination of genetic code. I mean, if the fallen angels do have DNA, (which presumably, they do), then were their angelic, semi-“immortal” bodies really just made by combining the same four amino acids which comprise our own genetic structure? (i.e. did they sacrifice their “spiritual body” when they chose to descend on mount Hermon, and become more or less like us, only with much more celestial knowledge?) Who knows? Maybe their DNA used more, or even different nuclebases than ours? (and maybe that’s part of why it was such a mess…

    But when pondering the whole possible connection between GM and the mark of the beast, I have also wondered if genetic manipulation could at some point be used to modify whatever physical/physiological components that play a part in “altared states”, and opening up oneself to the spiritual (demonic) realm. I mean, if it is possible to take a big dose of DMT or LSD, and suddenly have your pineal gland bombarded with enough chemicals that it essentially “loosens” the normal connection between your body and spirit, and allows you to suddenly enter the spiritual dimension, and talk with demonic beings, then couldn’t the same sort of thing be achieved via genetic manipulation? (especially since DMT is something that exists in our own bodies naturally, and in most life forms) Could people hypothetically be genetically altared in such a way, that they essentially had their “door opened” on a genetic level, and basically being condemned to a life of non-stop demonization? (frightening thought….)

    1. admin

      Great stuff there dude. I think it’s certainly possible that what we read in prophetic text is something akin to what you are describing.

      REV 18:23
      …for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries (pharmekeia) were all nations deceived.

      Dr.Future explored the possibility that the pineal gland is our gateway to the spiritual dimension and that perhaps what happened was that when Adam and Eve were banned from the Garden, they were from a physical garden, but also spiritually in that the pineal gland was closed off from receiving or being openly communicating with that other dimension. Now with drugs etc, it’s essentially a breach of the barrier that was set by God.

      Secondly, guys like Steve Quayle believe that these spiritual entities can manifest in the physical world in certain bodily figures which again plays right into the Jude scripture.

      JUDE 1:6
      And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

      So all of these things seem to be adding up to some really creepy stuff. We can’t say for sure what the exact science was behind it all, but rest assured, modern science hasn’t figured it out 😀

      Good stuff truth-is-stranger-than-fiction

      -Gonz

      1. Yeah, that presentation Dr. Future did on drugs and the spirit portal is absolutely fantastic. It was one of the first things by him that I came across, and it was super informative. However I haven’t heard Steve Quayle talk about the whole spiritual beings physically manifesting thing. (I’ve only listented to him a couple of times) I think I sorta distanced myself from Quayle after hearing him interviewing someone one time, and they were talking about what size of bullet you would need to effectively take down a moder-day Nephilim… (!?)

        But anyways, I have heard this guy Bill Schnoebelen also take about fallen angels that can physically manifest (fallen angels being distinct from demons in his view). Man, maybe you guys could try and get HIM on the podcast, that would be a trip… I still don’t fully know what to make of the guy. I mean, he seems pretty doctrinally sound, but his testimony is one that certainly tests the limits of “fringe” subject matter. I don’t know. He’s still around, has his own ministry. But most of the material of him speaking I’ve found has been from when he appeared on that “Prophecy Club” show…

        Anyways. So glad you guys are back! (and btw, you kept refering to the GM babies as having “3 sets of DNA”, but actually don’t they just have one set of DNA, which three genetic contributors?)

      2. Ooh, and one another thing… One of you guys briefly mentioned the connection between the Olympics/atheletic competition, and the spirit of transhumanism. And yeah, there is so much to unpack with that! Cuz, isn’t the whole underlying philosophical assumption that drives Olympic competition the idea that as humans we should be constantly striving to be faster, stronger, better? I mean, people would get really turned off to the whole thing if suddenly atheletes stopped breaking world records, and started getting further away from those benchmarks of “human potential”… You could probably do a whole show just about the Olympics, and the spirit behind them. If you ask me, the fact that they go back all the way to ancient Greece and everything only underscores the reality that there is a true, antichrist spirit at work in the whole thing. (In fact, I believe I remember seeing something somewhere that showed the olympic symbol, the five interlocking rings, can actually be found carved on a stone in the ruins of a temple of Apollo. Which if true, is pretty sobering…) Overall it definitely feels like the Olympic games are a huge vehicle by which the world populace has been conditioned to accept certain core values, values which can then be built upon with the more extreme and weird developments like GM, or bio-tech, or “psychic” evolution, or whatever. Anyhow, dang, it’s like every time you do a show, it opens up like five more topics that are probably worthy of more in depth discussion!

    2. Steph

      This was a great show and thanks for doing the shout-out. You guys are awesome and I’m thankful that I found your podcasts!

      I have a few different comments to make so hopefully this all makes sense. First… I think they’ve genetically modified pretty much everything now. I recently read that they are trying to release genetically modified mosquitoes… and one article I read said that they would inject a vaccine in us if we got bit by one… But I was just browsing through a bunch of things so I didn’t really look into that.

      I wanted to reply to your comment Truth is stranger than fiction… because I used to experiment with drugs like LSD and mushrooms. and for the longest time thought those drugs actually brought me closer to God and made me more spiritual. While I do believe I felt more ‘spritual’ I know now that it was not of God and I was being deceived. The last time I did this, I took LSD and it was probably the scariest time in my life. I always wanted to have that crazy spiritual experience that people had talked about. Like out of body…but I never felt like I made it to that level where others had been. Possibly because at this point I was covered by the grace of Christ.(But still living selfishly) I don’t know but while I was “tripping” I prayed but felt completely disconnected from God. I don’t know how else to describe it. The worst part was trying to go to sleep. I just couldnt… every time I closed my eyes, all I could see was creepy demon faces laughing at me! For hours! I am never messing with anything like that again. Obviously I have learned a lot since then. I’m not sure that has anything to do with what you were talking about even but I thought you might find it to be an interesting perspective on drugs and spiritual experiences.

      Learning about all this stuff is so fascinating and crazy. I too have thought about how I would be different if I had never been vaccinated and never been exposed to chemicals in foods and genetically modified foods. It is exciting to know that we will be restored one day to the way that God created us to be. 🙂 I cant wait!

      I agree with you guys that we all have a purpose being here in this time! Some crazy things are going on and God wants to use us and fulfill His purpose in our lives. Which is exciting although a bit scary at the same time.

      I know I jumped around to a bunch of subjects, but there is so much to talk about! I can’t wait to hear more from you guys! I love learning and being aware. Like I said…I’m young but I do not want to be ignorant so I’m glad that you are doing this and spreading this information to those that don’t know exactly where to learn about these things. Especially from a Christian perspective. Thanks!

      1. Steph, I actually had a very similar experience with LSD myself. (It feels like someone got into the “control panel” for your senses, and just started messing around with the controls…) It was indeed terrifying. I remember just feeling like, “Oh no, what did I just do?” and I kept seeing things that somehow I understood to be like “portals”, like this christmas ornament on a tree, it was like it was alive, and I could just “dive in” and go somewhere, if I were only to stare at it long enough. (I was very intent on not staring at it!) Even though we were indoors, it was as if the roof was lifted off and I could just feel this huge expanse all around us, and I could feel all sorts of shadowy presences moving about above me. I don’t think I’ve ever prayed to Jesus so hard in my life. All in all, I totally repented of using such drugs, but God did use that to give me a tiny glimpse of what you’re really messing with when you start dabbling in those areas….

        But it really illustrates the point pretty well, doesn’t it? You can open “doorways” from both the physical side, or the spiritual side. Drugs is definitely one way to do so on the physical side, who knows, maybe at some point GM could be another…?

  10. Ian Coyle

    Hey guys. I have a PhD in molecular biology and I wanted to interject a little genetic theory here. The technique used to create the transgenic eggs can have 2 effects: 1) it can replace a defective gene in the egg with a normal version of that gene. In this case, the organism is still human because it contains the same library of genes, where one gene has been swapped out for a new copy of that gene. The individual genes may come from three or more parents, but the actual number of genes on the chromosomes of the baby is unchanged. It is still a human baby, although the spiritual origin of that baby is unprecedented because it has its origin in three parents instead of two.

    A useful analogy is to think of the human set of chromosomes like a “neighborhood” with a set of dwellings that are in fixed locations along the length of each chromosome, like homes along a street. Each location is the address of a gene that has a specified function in the organism, but the sequence of the gene at that address can vary from person to person. These variable gene sequences at one specific location, or chromosomal address, are called “alleles.” We say that person A has a different allele than person B at genetic locus #3,000. If a gene is swapped in an egg, then you have placed a different allele at a single genetic locus, but you havent made the chromosomal structure abnormal – you havent redesigned the layout of the neighborhood or added a new address to the map.

    In actuality, the human chromosomes comprise about 75,000 genetic loci (addresses for genes), with each locus designated for a gene that accomplishes a specific function, where any number of alleles may exist for that gene at that locus.

    Now, here is where we jump off a taller bridge: 2) If you were to add a NEW LOCUS, or add a new residence to the neighborhood, you have made a new chromosomal arrangement, so that now the organism produced has a different genetic map. For example a GMO baby with new loci may end up having 75,002 genes instead of the normal 75,000 genes. NOW you have created a new species. Now the organism is no longer human and the spiritual questions enter a new dimension.

    Summary:
    In the first case (1), you have a human being with the normal human arrangement of the genome, but you have 3 parents. You have merely swapped alleles. The only abnormality about that organism is the fact that the alleles come from 3 sources, 3 parents, and not the normal two. Nevertheless, the spiritual issues are probably enough to bring Gods judgment down upon us all.

    In the second case (2), you have achieved something much more drastic. You have created a new species with extra genes, extra genetic loci, doing things that no organism has ever had done within it. This is equivalent to a Nephilim. Now you have something that a geneticist would look at and say, “this chromosomal arrangement is not human.” Swapping alleles is nothing serious compared to adding genetic loci. If you make enough chromosomal additions, at some point the GMO organism becomes incompatible with humans during reproduction (because the chromosomes from the two beings will not be the same length or have the same arrangement, and therefore will tangle into a ball of goo and kill the embryo or create a sterile progeny). But individuals having extra chromosomal segments could nevertheless be created and be made to be compatible with each other. Talk about the rise of the Beast….

    I know its complicated, but Id be happy to answer any specific questions or send you some references if you want to shoot me an email anytime. Great show Im a big fan!

    Ian
    ian@iancoyle.net

    1. Great explanation Ian. Thanks!

    2. Wow, Ian, we definitely need someone with your background in conversations like these!

      Hey, I’m curious about your perspective on something. The other day I watched this video done by Guy Malone and “Paradox Brown” called “Case Against the Book of Enoch”:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIXeDYIYf8Q&list=PL18C695724F98C1BD&index=1&feature=plpp_video

      I bring it up because somewhere in the middle of it, they get into this whole issue of how the spirit is passed on from parents to children, as they talk about this “principle of replication”, basically making an argument for the idea that while both parents contribute genetics to their offspring, it is through the father that the spirit is passed on.

      Curious what you (or anyone else) might think about something like that. I don’t know that I have reached a conclusion about it one way or another, but it certainly gave me food for thought…

  11. Tina

    What about like “insurance policies” (as it were) for those who are told they have, say terminal illnesses or if they are in a car accident and need “replacement” organs or body parts? Have you seen that movie “The Island”? Every time a “person” wass rewarded by getting to leve the island, it was a trick. It just meant that whoever had “purchased” them needed them for “parts” as it were. Crazy stuff!

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  13. Rhonda

    Hi! I just discovered your podcasts and I’m really enjoying them. I’m listening to the older ones and this whole GM Babies concerns me. God doesn’t want us messing around with this. What happens if you are trying to get the DNA from someone who is a great athlete but is also secretly a serial killer? They can’t separate the good part of the DNA from the bad part, can they? That reminds me of the movie “Twins.” Do you remember that movie? They made of milkshake of all these great men’s DNA and got Arnold Schwarznegger – and also Danny DeVito. It was a funny movie but with it becoming a reality now it’s kind of scary.

  14. Roni
  15. Dustin

    Kind of late to this conversation. Just discovered you guys a few weeks ago and listening through the archives.

    Reminds me of the old Star Trek episode “Space Seed” where Kirk finds a group of cryogenicly frozen superhumans that fled earth in the 1990s.

    Of course this was the introduction of Khan who would later appear in the movie Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan (1982).

    Gene Roddenberry (creator of Trek) was an atheist, but even he saw the dangers of eugenics. This episode and the subsequent movie showed how eugenics can go totally wrong.

    Awesome show.

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