CCR 070: Homo Capensis with Karen Hudes and Dr. Spencer

THEY SAY HISTORY is written by it’s victors. And this might be true…to a degree. But how much established history should we throw out, simply because it’s based on institutionalized academia? In this episode, Basil and Gonz have a discussion with Karen Hudes and Dr. Ed Spencer not only about the hidden hand that guides the world’s banking systems, but also their conviction that our established history has been covering up the existence of a race of large brained hominids termed, Homo Capensis. According to Hudes and Dr. Spencer, humanity is and has been under attack by these large brain hominids who openly ruled the world during the Ice Age and strive to openly dominate the world again, crushing Homo sapiens into a small population controlled by electronic brain manipulation run by supercomputers.

During the conversation, Basil and Gonz do not press on the many issues that Hudes and Dr. Spencer bring up as part of their supporting evidence  for this worldview. However, on this post, we will provide some counter positions so that you can decide for yourself where the truth may lie. First we will look at a list of points made in favor of the Homo Capensis existing, followed by the counter arguments made for each with links and resources so that you can come to your own conclusions.

PRO Homo Capensis

The following is a list of arguments made by Dr. Ed Spencer that he believes serve as data points to support the theory of Homo Capensis.

1-The world was mapped in the Ice Age. They were highly advanced even knowing spherical trigonometry. They must have been the Homo Capensis.

2-Cone Head skulls found all around the world suggest that there is another humanoid race on earth. Brien Forester’s preliminary DNA work shows that they are not human.

3-Megalithic structures build all around the world must have been built by the Homo Capensis.

4-Ruins in South Africa were probably prison cells for humans kept in check by the Homo Capensis who enslaved us. “We’re their pets…” as Dr. Ed Spencer puts it.

5-The brain cavity of a Homo Capensis is 30% larger than the average human, making their IQ much higher. This is based on the Boskop skulls found in the early 1900’s, commentary on those findings by R. Broom (who Dr. Spencer feels has been deliberately covered up) and a recent book written by Lynch and Granger called Big Brain.

6-Andrew Lobaczewski in his Book: Political Ponerology, A science of the study of Evil Adjusted for Political Purposes, reviews the strange mental states of so many of our leaders, thus providing evidence that our leaders are influenced by the Homo Capensis.

7-The UFO-ET story is a cover up to veil the truth about the Big Brain Hominids, who can be classified as Crypto-terrestrials.

8-Akhenaten, an ancient Egyptian Pharaoh is Abraham or Moses, leading to the theory that the cover up of Homo Capensis began back in the days of ancient Israel and that the ancient fathers of Israel may have been Homo Capensis themselves. Such a theory is further considered based on the writings of Eustace Mullins, Andrew Carrington Hitchcock, and others to suggest that the same coverup continues today.

9-Thus the Bible is not true and cannot be trusted.

a.) They burned 300 books at the Council of Nicea.

b.) The word “rapture” was added to the Bible.

c.) Circumcision

Counter Arguments for Homo Capensis Evidence


According to Dr. Ed Spencer, the entire earth was mapped during the Ice Age when sea level was approximately 400 ft. lower and there was no Ice over the Queen Maud Land Coast of Antarctica.  The mysterious civilization that did this knew spherical trigonometry. One piece of evidence that he bring up is author Charles Hapgood who wrote the book, Maps of the Ancient Sea Kings: Evidence of an Advanced Civilization in the Ice Age

Counter Argument: According to many who are critical of the work of Hapgood, the research done was shoddy and didn’t take into account alternative information regarding the maps that were investigated. They suggest that the maps aren’t as accurate as Hapgood makes it out to be and that they depend largely on the assumption that different portions of each map examined came from an earlier map, and that there were errors during the copying process. Hapgood also ignores the countless maps made by native americans who explored the arctic. While the speculations made are interesting, there is a reason why much of his research has been dismissed by orthodox science, and it’s not necessarily because of a coverup. Even if it were true that there was a highly advanced civilization during the Ice Age it could be pointing to an antediluvian culture described in the Bible and not necessarily that of Homo Capensis.

One of the maps that was brought up in the conversation is the Piri Reis map. Here is a link by Ancient Aliens Debunked that talks about the Piri Reis map that explains how even the Piri Reis map was just an “Okay map for the time.”



It is true that there are strange skulls that have been found all around the world. Some of these skulls are in the shape of cone heads. According to our colleague and friend LA Marzulli, these skulls are evidence for Nephilim providing evidence that there are beings here on earth that were bred from the unholy union of fallen angels and human women. While Karen Hudes refuted this in the conversation when she said that this was impossible because the DNA did not match, it begs the questions; where did she get the DNA information and how does she know this?

To get more information regarding these investigations, check out LA Marzulli’s books where he has been documenting his travels with Brien Forester to Peru and other places around the world to investigate these skulls.



Similar to the Cone Heads, LA Marzulli has given his theory as to how these structures were created. It is obvious that the topic of megalithic structures is a fascinating one filled with speculation. While no one can say for sure who made them, the theory put forth by LA Marzulli is that it was the Nephilim. The Ancient Aliens camp suggests it’s the aliens who built all the megalithic structures, and Dr. Spencer is putting forth the theory that it was the Homo Capensis. But what the reality is far more mundane?

In the work of Chris White in his film Ancient Aliens Debunked, counter arguments are put forth against the Ancient Aliens theory of these megalithic structures. He demonstrates that there doesn’t necessarily need to be advanced alien technologies, nor giants to construct some of these structures. In the same way, it would suffice to say that these structures don’t necessarily need Homo Capensis in order for construction either.


The link that was provided by Dr. Ed Spencer on this topic is:

Again, while the prospect is interesting, there is no concrete evidence that these stone structures are anything out of the ordinary. While the website argue that there are astronomical alignments with some of the stones that were placed here, again this doesn’t necessarily serve any evidence to suggest that the Homo Capensis are responsible agents for such construction. In fact, the link provided suggests that it was the aliens who genetically engineered us, based largely on a liberal rendering of the Ancient Sumerian cosmologies. So where or why this necessarily has to be Homo Capensis is again not addressed by Dr. Ed Spencer in the conversation, and should serve as at least a point of skepticism that such explanations are valid.


According to Dr. Ed Spencer, these Homo Capensis had large brain cavities that allowed for larger brains and thus higher IQ. The speculation was drawn from a book called Big Brain by Professors Gary Lynch and Richard Granger. While the proposition is made based on a skull found in Africa called the Boskop skull, modern scholars are skeptical of Lynch and Granger. For example, paleoanthropologist John Hawkes stated this about the book:

“I hate to think that the theme of a 2008 book was pulled straight from a 1958 essay, but I don’t know where else they would have gotten the idea. No anthropologists have written much about the so-called “Boskopoids” since 1958. There is no such thing as an “IQ estimate” for a fossil human; that’s entirely nonsensical. There’s no question that there have been massive cultural changes in the last 10,000 years. But the idea that our brains’ functions have atrophied from some Pleistocene state has been left long behind in the dust of nineteenth-century race studies. So I’m left wondering: Why would two neuroscientists, after going to all the trouble to write a book about the evolution of the human brain, use completely obsolete anthropological information without doing a simple Google search to see if the facts have stayed the same as in 1923?”

Furthermore, we enquired our friend and colleague archeologist, Dr. Aaron Judkins about the Boskop skull and here is what he had to say:

“So called Boskop Man was not a new species, but a variation of modern humans. The original skull was incomplete raising major questions about the quality and interpretation of the finds.”

You can read the complete report on the Boskop skull made by Dr. Aaron Judkins in the PDF provided below:



According to Dr. Ed Spencer, a study from a book by Andrew Lobaczewski called Political Ponerology: A science of the study of Evil Adjusted for Political Purposesshows that in fact, the leaders and elite of humanity are clinically insane. While we agree with this premise, the study has some interesting history, as well as conjectures that is worth a second look.

First off, the document plays off the “it’s been suppressed” dogma based on some historical factors. Mainly that the original research was burned during a raid in Poland. They claim that the second copy which was reconstructed under “impossible conditions of violence and repression” was sent to the Vatican without hearing anything in return. The third copy, which is what we now have, was re-written from memory by one of the original researchers Lobasczewski (the last survivor of the research), but was blocked by Zbigniew Brzezinski for publication.

While there is no hard evidence that any of this is true, it makes one wonder why there was only one copy to begin with, but also why even after the first reconstruction, they would send the one and only copy to the Vatican? And then furthermore, even if it were suppressed for publication by Zbigniew Brzezinski, why would they want his stamp of approval for it? Wouldn’t it make much more sense to simply publish the material? Not to mention the work seems to have been reconstructed from memory.

The content itself is also strife with logical inconsistencies. While the claim of the author is to provide an explanation for evil without any supernatural leanings, it makes the assumption that “evil” itself is real and true without any objective point of reference. Without this reference, such a thing as evil would merely be a subjective phenomenon making it simply something that would support the Darwinian evolution paradigm of “survival of the fittest.”

Furthermore, even given that evil is real and that such things do occur, there is nothing substantially groundbreaking about the research. It seems to state the obvious such as emotions and environmental conditions influence an individual to commit evil acts. By avoiding any supernatural or even metaphysical agencies or realities as part of the realm of possibility to explain evil, this study was probably not suppressed, but merely dismissed on appropriate grounds that it doesn’t provide sufficient argument for evil. Not to mention, even if the world’s leaders are not psychopathic, why would anyone allow the publication of a work that would jeopardize their political and social influence? It would seem less of a coverup and more of a rational act to protect one’s public perception of character. And if they truly were psychopathic, why would they care if it was publicly known?

And lastly, how does this study in any way shape or form support the premise that the Homo Capensis is behind it? Rather, a more accurate explanation could be stated in that there is sin in the world and that every man is infected with it.



On page 76 of a letter written by R. Broom states this about the Boskop skull mentioned earlier:

But fortunately it is unlikely that any one will, after Elliot Smith’s report on the brain cast, maintain that the large brain of the Boskop skull is pathological and there seems to remain but one conclusion, namely, that in South Africa in very early times there lived a race of primitive man characterized by having a large skull with very thick parietal bosses, a brain of great size and a powerful jaw with incisors and canines much larger than those in modern man. For this type of which we at present only know the one specimen, I propose the name Homo capensis, regarding it as sufficiently distinct from Homo sapiens to be worthy of specific rank.”

The remark was made back in 1918 and has been largely dismissed as a misdiagnosis, largely because they were only working from fractions of the skull. The suggestion of the fringe community is that such a skull is evidence for ET and UFOs. While this is possible, one would have to dismiss all of the evidence and speculation drawn from the entirety of the Ufological community. In similar fashion to the Ancient Astronaut theory, it would have to be said that every strange anomaly or unexplained phenomena is attributed to Homo Capensis. Again, while one should leave such possibilities open, to suggest it as fact without any sort of hard evidence would be taking a leap of faith.


When we first asked Karen Hudes how this entire banking system ties into the topic of Homo Capensis, her response was that Akhenaten, an ancient Egyptian Pharaoh, was in fact Abraham of the Bible. Without any obvious logical connection, it would have to be assumed that what she meant was that the Old Testament account was the start of a great coverup for the existence of the Homo Capensis, and that Abraham was not human, or a prophet of God, but rather a Homo Capensis himself.

To begin, the theory of Akhenaten being one of the Biblical characters is nothing new. The speculation has led from the Pharaoh being Abraham, Joseph, and even Moses. The speculation arises mostly from the idea that since Akhenaten seems to be the first monotheistic pharaoh, it follows that the Biblical character of either Abraham, Moses, or Joseph, who touted monotheism, is the same person. For example, an article called Akhenaten: The First String of Monotheism, outright states that such a notion is “…pure speculation to fill the gaps…” even admitting that while there is a written history of the ancient Hebrews, there isn’t evidence outside of the Bible, and therefore the theory can remain a possibility.

But perhaps the most popular account of such a speculation is by a gentlemen named Ahmed Osmon who suggested that Akhenaten was Moses from the Biblical account. While he makes his case in several books, these accounts have not been taken seriously at the academic level, mainly because of his sloppy and inconsistent approach to the evidence. Some of it seems to be outright wrong. In an attempt to get some input on this matter, we contacted Dr. Michael S. Heiser, a scholar in semitic languages. He had this to say to us in an email and a link where he blogged about this topic.

“…there is in fact no evidence for it. There is only conjecture and “correlation-causation” errors of thinking. (Not to mention the serious chronological disconnects). He [Osmon] builds a theory that requires the Bible to be “corrected” to work. Osman is not a credible source…He’s considered a hack by people in the relevant fields.”


9-THE BIBLE IS FALSE (Council of Nicea & the Rapture)

So with all of this speculation, the conclusion that Karen Hudes and Dr. Ed Spencer came to is that the Bible cannot be trusted. While such a position based on the evidence provided is a severe case of inductive reasoning, we still suggest that one keeps and open mind and do their own study and come to their own conclusions. That being said, some key points made by Karen Hudes before she hung up need to be addressed.

a.) 300 Books Burned at the Council of Nicea

The first claim was that there were 300 books burned at the Council of Nicea. After searching for the source, it was discovered that this was a rumor started on the internet with no credible source. The truth was that the work of Arius was rejected and that his works, which reflected Arianism were burned for several years after the Council met. This is a far cry from the suggestion that the 300 books contained evidence for the Homo Capensis. The link below will provide a starting point for discovering the truth regarding this matter.


b.) The word “rapture” was added in the Bible

The second claim made by Karen Hudes was that the word “Rapture” was added in the Bible. To tear down this view is fairly simple. First, it should be noted that the word “rapture” doesn’t exactly appear in the Bible. But the concept is certainly there. And while a point could be made that the modern view of pre-tribulation is in fact something that was more or less” fabricated” by a Jesuit priest named Darby back in the 1800’s, the word and concept itself does come directly from the Bible. In 1 Thessalonians 4:17, the most popular rapture verse in the Bible says this:

Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.”

The word for “caught up” in the original Greek is “Harpazo.” This word was translated in the Latin Vulgate was “Rapturo” and this is where the english word “rapture” comes from. Thus, to suggest that it was added in the Bible is unfounded.

c.) Circumcision

The final piece of relevant information that supposedly makes the Bible erroneous and evil is the topic of circumcision. Dr. Ed Spencer claimed during the latter part of the conversation that circumcision was in fact a form of mind control and population control because certain hormones in the foreskin were being cut off, and therefore the population of each generation, dumber.

This notion goes against many of the scientific studies reported about circumcision, such as provided in the links below:


However, there are plenty of people who suggest that circumcision is mutilation, or worse, that Dr. Ed Spencer’s speculation is correct. Such a theory comes from a website page that’s titled Hormone Manipulation. Here, an Australian geologist by the name of Jean-Paul Turcaud provides his reasoning for why circumcision is wrong. He suggests that the foreskin contains valuable hormones that help develop the endocrine system which is largely responsible for controlling our emotions, moods, overall hormonal balance, and even chakras. While the study seems to begin with a strictly scientific bent, it quickly dives into pseudoscience when he brings up chakras. But is that weren’t enough, once again, a strong antisemitic fervor is felt when he states:

This discovery of mine is of greatest importance indeed than all my Mining Discoveries & Geological Discoveries and I am handing it out free of charge for the bettering of Humanity ! … and as my Knight Templar’s standards requires me to do ! Of course the case is well documented and at this point in time, this is my duty indeed to impart that knowledge to Humanity at large ! It shows that the whole Semite JIC (Jew; Islamic; Christian ) Sects are in fact a complete fraud, and the matter of importance in the Jew system have been carefully put out of the reach of the Common.” 

…and furthermore…

Unfortunately the Xians children bear the awful consequences of such debased and ignorant way of living… with the typical Coward trait of Christian society. Their propensity to lay low, to crawl in front of authority, to accept as gospel truth anything spoken sufficiently loud & strong!!”

Such a sentiment is not only a sweeping generalization of all people who declare themselves to be part of the Abrahamic faiths, but a comment stemming from blinding pride. Obviously the agenda prior to the study was to denounce the Bible and Christianity and so any “data” that would seem to support such a premise would be used.


As a way to close this post, it would seem that what Karen Hudes and Dr. Ed Spencer were promoting was one perspective to a puzzle that we are all trying to figure out. While no one has the exclusive corner on the market place of truth, there are many presuppositions at work here. On Canary Cry Radio, we work with the presupposition that there is a God and that He communicated to us through his Word, the Bible, and also that Jesus Christ who is the Word in flesh died for our sins and rose again. But for the guests, the presuppositions were a bit more ambiguous, unclear but perhaps touting Darwinian evolution and reductionist materialism as their basis, or even an eastern philosophy that rings of universalism. Either way, it was clear that their agenda was to reject the Biblical account.

The evidence they provided is the same evidence that we can all see. Insert the phrase “Homo Capensis” instead of “Ancient Aliens” and one would seemingly have the same working theory. But regardless of which one is correct, it should be noted that all the evidence that was suggested on this episode comes from alternative research. That in itself is not a bad thing because alternative research in vital and key in unlocking many mysteries that academic scholarship just doesn’t tackle. At the same time, it would be a mistake to “throw the baby out with the bath water.” In other words, there is value put forth by established academia that should be noted and considered. In fact, the very point that Dr. Ed Spencer and Karen Hudes both went to Yale University as a means to suggest their authority in scholarship, but then call the establishment a source for the coverup of Homo Capensis appears contradictory at best. In the end, we are all working from a presupposed philosophy to shape our worldview, and thus it makes it vital that each person do their own homework and come to their own conclusions.

Acts 17:11

Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessalonica; they received the word with all eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so.”


Lo-Fi File (Click HERE)

41 comments… add one
  1. John

    I thoroughly enjoyed listening to Karen’s meltdown. I’m pretty sure she lost her mind when Basil asked her to stop pounding on her keyboard – people who are in awe of their own intelligence and education don’t take kindly to any sort of correction.

  2. Kathy G.

    It was an interesting interview. Some of it was new to me. When you tried to pinpoint Karen Hudes to actual sources of her assertions (ie, the 300 books being burned), she reacted rather indignantly and seemed used this to distract from having to answer the question. Its too bad that when you try to decipher (or even clarify) what they are actually saying they become angry and do a walk off. Dr. Ed Spencer blaming everything on the behind-the-scene Jews brought back the German (and knights Templar) mind-set of why it was necessary to purge Europe (and ultimately the world) of the Jews. I thought you both were quite professional at handling the interview. Keep up the good work.

    1. TheGoliestCrow

      Kathy, you silly brainwashed nincompoop. Hitler and the Nazis were not trying to purge the world of Jews. They were trying to purge the world of Communist Bolsheviks who had just finished murdering 66 million Christians I. Russia and the Ukraine. Hitler, being 25% Jewish himself, had between 100K and 150K Jewish soldiers in his Wermacht. As documented by Riggs in his book “Hitlers Jewish Soldiers”. Let’s not forget that the Zionist Bolsgeviks openly declared war on Germany and Hitler in 1933. Those who were German citizens would by any standard be considered a TRAITOR, and what is the usual penalty for treason ? Loyal Nazi Jews did very well for themselves under Hitler, learning their lessons very well from Der Feurer. Everything you think you know is wrong because you have been lied to and brainwashed all your life.

  3. Nobunaga

    I cannot believe you had the audacity to ask Karen a question, that is disrespect enough but you then went on to show blatant disregard for her infallible authority on all thing and even hinted at a disagreement…. How dare you !

    How dare you ask a question in an interview…the very thought of it.

    Seriously though in a world of cultural marxism and postmodern thinking where i have my truth and you have yours and i’m too afraid to disagree with you for fear i hurt your precious feelings, i respect her making a strong stand and saying no your wrong and i’m right i wish more Christians were like this….minus the hubris and arrogance of course.

    God willing they both repent and believe the Gospel and are lead to the truth, both of them are so close to the truth but are unwilling/unable to see the truth of the Bible staring them in the face and how the Christian world view can explain all these things they have found.

    Thomas Sowell said the problem with intellectuals is that they excel in a small field of expertise and then think it translate to all disciplines, this is not true as shown by stephen Hawking… he is the best physicists in the world but he sucks at philosophy and theology yet is welcomed by the world and accepted based on his expertise in a totally different field. I take what Karen says on the financial aspects of this interview but when she moves into the realm of principalities, powers and rulers in high places she is a rank amature and should be open to learn from an ancient source of wisdom that has stood the test of time and described all these strange things. i.e (the bible)

    Thomas Sowell on the Vulgar Pride of Intellectuals.

  4. whythetruth

    Very interesting interview. It seems like a good portion of their information comes from a “researcher” named Michael Tellinger. These two seem like they would be much more at home doing an interview with Project Camelot. Karen also had a meltdown on Trunews while being pushed on her information by Rick Wiles. It’s amazing to me how the New Age movement can take any information and try to make it fit. Although, I guess in a way, that is what we try to do with the Bible as well. The difference is, there has not been any information that has to be bent in a million ways to make fit with the biblical account. Thanks for doing the interview!

    1. admin

      Thanks for listening. This is Gonz the co-host.

      Tellinger was one of the sources Dr. Ed Spencer provided me with. I listened to a lot of Project Camelot, and I don’t mind the show necessarily. I didn’t really buy Dan Burisch and his whole account a few years back and haven’t followed them a whole lot since. I won’t dismiss it outright but it seemed a bit of a stretch. Nevertheless, I’m not too fond of Bill Ryan’s new age ideas.

      You mentioned “The difference is, there has not been any information that has to be bent in a million ways to make fit with the biblical account.” I get that there have been some strange interpretations etc. But what examples do you have of such an account where something was “bent a million different ways” to make it fit the Bible? Because in my experience, things seem to settle in quite nicely when you render the data points through the Biblical worldview. But of course, the biblical worldview could vary from person to person, but an overall grasp of the Bible, especially believers who have a good hold on the “fringe” topics, seem to coalesce well.

  5. gina

    Wow. Just wow. I thought the LAST interviewee was a piece of work, and now this!

    You guys did a great job. These two were really hard to follow, and I really didn’t get the puzzle even after they put it together. But it was interesting!

    BTW, why you dissin’ the spleen? You can live without it, but it has something to do with the immune system. My nephew had his spleen removed as the result of a bike accident as a young teen and died from complications of the flu in his very early 20’s. The MD attributed it to the fact that he had no spleen and could not fight off the infection. Off topic, I know.

    1. admin

      We apologize if we offended you about the spleen comment. We were just “shooting from the hip” as they say with a comment about the spleen based on rumor that it has no function in the human body. We’re sorry about your nephew as well. God Bless and thanks for listening.

  6. MargoNYC

    Wow, what a strange interview. Karen Hudes starts out as scholarly and articulate, but quickly unravels into total drivel then shuts down when challenged. Basil and Gonz must have LA Marzulli on the show asap to set the record straight.

    1. Spray Psalm

      Yes, I agree. Bring LA on again to discuss, dissect the above interview. At the end you guys are talking about the Khazarian Conspiracy. I think that this whole line of logic offered by your guests could easily have been refuted in the moment had you had some salient arguments reflecting the Khazrian conspiracy, Protocols of Zion, etc… The Learned Protocols of Elders of Zion has been thoroughly put to rest. However, there is good research on Khazarian history, and though I am not anti-Semetic, I think taking it into context when discussing this info is a responsible handling of the subject. Here is the best history on the Khazars I have found. Most of that history is locked in Chinese texts and has yet to be translated. Which explains some of the confusion. But the ‘protocols’ are to be debunked, as it it propaganda coming from Russia…

  7. oh. my. goodness.

    I got a serious chuckle listening to this one! Getting hung up on by Karen Hudes? You guys have arrived! a doozy indeed…

    sort of the polar opposite of the last guest, in the sense that these folks are aware of global conspiracy, yet their rejection of the Truth of the bible pushes them to a completely different (and bizarre) means of trying to make sense out of who is really behind it all…

    I have watched Karen on youtube a few times before, and had no idea that someone who came out of the financial sector and was exposed to the global conspiracy from that angle would actually be so devoid of basic reason, but when you consider her ultimate hostility to the message of the Gospel, I suppose it’s not that surprising.

    Overall a pretty instructive example of how a conspiratorial worldview, and a distrust for everything in recorded history, can be twisted and used to just reject anything you don’t like… (i.e., what the Bible really does say)

    She’d rather just spew out claims that she just read on the internet somewhere and insist that they’re fact, sounding like some 12 year old who has no concept of what it means to really research something and weigh the evidence, than be open to the possibility that God said what He said…

    anyhow, you guys did great. Handled it all with a lot of grace and wisdom and patience. this one is an episode to remember for sure!

  8. Dave

    Poor Karen, one would think that her professional career would have endowed her with with the ability to debate.

    I’m not sure the overall purpose of this podcast, although I appreciate you guys putting interesting topics out there and all the hard work you do.

    There is no proof for the Nephelim that we can hold on to. There is speculation and curiosities as evidenced by L.A. Marzuli and his work but even Christians in all denominations argue over this entity.

    The same goes for Homo Copensis. The skull fragments found were incomplete and modeled to create a whole. Some anthropologist state that while large, the skulls could fit with the upper ends of skulls present today.

    What is most disturbing is stating a hypothesis as fact…. on each side. Hubris such as this leads one to be discredited through close mindedness and can only limit their own search for truth by way of blocking alternatives that may illuminate facts and truths.

    Karen’s lip service to Jesus and her view of our spiritual mission seems inline with current new age processes and the elimination of any true belief, though I can not see into her essence and wouldn’t want to make judgements on her actual beliefs.

    Lastly, maybe this was covered but I don’t remember hearing it is; where are the Homo Copensis now? If they’ve been around since the ice age and before one would think they would be the most prevalent sentient species on the planet and be glorifying their greatness with great monuments and temples. Why hide?

    1. TheHolyCrow

      Dave, you are really exposing your ignorance of the skulls of Homo Capensis. The evidence is not just a few broken skulls, but includes at least 300 skulls found in Paracas, Peru. These are all intact and some even still have copious amounts of hair. Tha facts are that not only is the cranial cavity 25% to 33% larger than a human skull, but the bony structure is much thicker and heavier than a human. There are only 2 parietal lobes, as compared to 3 for a human. The eye sockets are larger around but shallower than human, and at the back of the skull there are small holes where either blood vessels or nerves passed through to feed the larger brain, some surmise. Similar skulls have been found in Egypt, China, Russia, etc, demonstrating that there may be 5 or more varieties of Homo Capensis. Preliminary DNA testing has been recently completed and the verdict so far is that they ARE NOT human. Further DNA work has to be done but it is difficult to find scientists brave enough to take the attendant heat from the morons in the academic elite community. Many still remember one scientist who had his eyes poked out for daring to look thru a telescope. You must be a newby to this subject because you clearly don’t know what you are talking about.

  9. dougovermyer

    I’m only into the 28 minute mark, and already my eyebrows have pulled a Spock like 5 times, my jaw has dropped at least once. I wish we could have had a video Basil’s and Gonz’s expressions during this interview.

  10. amelia

    Good job on keeping your cool guys! I know I could not have engaged with Karen in such a professional manner. You both represented Christians awesomely!!

  11. Michael Sean

    In a strange way this kind of New Age sci-fi lead me to Christ. It was when I looked into the claims of David Icke, Ian R Crane, Graham Hancock, and the likes that I came out the other side a Christian.

    In that respect it’s useful to have these people on your show and give us their opinions on such matters. It ends up strengthening my faith in Christ.


  12. Jonny

    Congratulations for taking on the notoriously flakey and erratic Hude. I haven’t listened to one interview of her that doesn’t end with her getting offended and freaking out when capensis is mentioned..
    Funny you should look into Capensis , was just recently looking into it for a chuckle.

    Can’t say I’m a fan of circumcision for any reason other than medical. Some f the procedures still used are barbaric.
    Great work guys.

  13. BH

    James I. Nienhuis,
    is a Bible believing professing Christian who has written a book on the ancient maps and ice age called Ice Age Civilizations, he would be a good guest on Canary Cry.

  14. elissaGRACE


    You guys were spot on. You could not have debated this,they rejected consideration at middle ground. It would not have been appropriate to debate, you guys did what we are supposed to do. BRAVO.

    they know not the perfection and power of God nor the fact that we are sinners and no matter how much we may want the golden rule enforced, only a perfect Jesus Christ can administer this sort of a kingdom… and wow 2x,
    yes.. we can and do imagine this world, it is coming right after the “extinction” he is seeing coming… he is right, his confusion is not knowing Jesus. How so sad!!

    Can you not just hear Jesus say:
    “light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that does truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.”
    They have never read the bible, they do not know how the answers are all in there and the gaps are filled in by the Holy Spirit in our walk with God. Man, I feel for these people.

    we should pray for them.

    For sure she does not know the bible frees men from the authority of men who control religion with a pretense of spirituality.

    She hung up to hide her error from whatever light was coming.

    “LAW is written on our hearts”
    each man knows on some level the Word of God is true. So she fled knowing if she presents her skepticism sincerely, especially to a group of believers, though she will be reproved with the answer; there is an answer, just waiting for her surrender the chains of her doubt. This is precisely why Jesus tells us:
    “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
    And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”

    Quite frankly you guys could not have won this one, it was bond in deception. The TRUTH scares more than it comforts. We are Christians. We do not judge, we discern. We have a tool for this discernment and it will save the men who care to consider it. Most won’t.

    Vanity kills.

    You may reach out to her and offer her a chance at a retake or a more formal closing statement.
    Try to disarm her with the invitation that we want to know what she knows and if it doesn’t agree with our view, so be it. We can either let it be, investigate for ourselves, or even offer her the reasoning behind our disagreement… but she was not in the line of unfriendly fire and she ducked out like she was. I would offer her a fly spot to say her piece if she refuses a follow up of pre-written questions you want to ask her.. so she will know she is not being attacked- clearly she misread you guys- not your fault… deception is ugly. But you can kindly give her a way out of a bad decision to hang up in haste, let her know you’ll air it before the same audience, on her terms because it’s clear you did not want her to do that. If you give her room to open up that error, the light has room to shine on it, if not for her, at least for others who will follow her.

    Matt5 44
    But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

    45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

  15. Brian

    Interesting interview. As everyone said, you guys handled it very well. I find it fascinating to hear from non-Christians about these things because you can see that they have looked at much of the same evidence that we have but then their perception/conclusions of that evidence has been influenced by the theories of other men and women like David Icke and his reptilians. But if they just kept taking it a step further, they would realize they are still missing pieces to the puzzle. And ultimately, if they looked at the Bible with an open heart and mind, they would realize that it truly does have the most complete picture on these matters.

    But I do not believe you can become a Christian through a process of logic like that. Ultimately, it is a spiritual conversion by conviction. They need to realize through reading the Bible or by another Christian that they are dead in their sin and hopeless without a perfect sacrifice for them – that was Christ. Only then, with the obtaining of the Holy Spirit, can they begin to comprehend these things properly and be able to trust something or someone in this world of deception and lies that is ruled by Satan and the other fallen angels and demons.

    And I agree with ElissaGrace that Karen started getting aggressive because some light was shining on her. She began sounding hypocritical with her statements like, “the truth isn’t comfortable,” yet she refused to even hear a potential truth that Gonz was presenting. And so you could tell that deep down her comfortable world view of obtaining her own spiritual enlightenment and being able to put an end to this controlling physical super-human race was being challenged.

    Hopefully she will figure out soon that her battle does not end with the alleged Homo Capensis and the cooperating humans but rather with a whole army of spiritual beings. And if she wants to be on the right side of that war, she must put her pride aside and join Christ, The Son of God, by placing her faith in His death, burial, and resurrection, as the perfect sacrifice for her sins!

    Thanks again guys.

  16. simon

    I thought it pretty plain that Hudes is a disinformation agent and the same goes with ‘dr’ spencer. 5 minutes of google research on her is all it takes. A few obvious clues : she’s from yale, she worked at world bank. No one, and I mean no one comes from those circles and exits as a whistleblower. Do you think that someone educated at yale(supposedly) would really hold such obviously inane opinions? Why would someone who claims to hold meetings with the power elite want to speak on a christian radio show?

    Common tactics from disinfo agents include partial truth and a lot of lies, being belligerent, annoying, disruptive, lies so obvious that you had to be born yesterday to believe. I was expecting her to claim the moon landings were a hoax. With disinfo its always about blaming everything on the jews and attacking christianity while claiming you are a believer. Note she didn’t go nutbar until gonz and basil started in on questioning her on her biblical claims…which were so stupid that one has to wonder at the audacity of someone like that. Even basil started laughing at one point.

    Her partner there was no better. He spun a yarn so long and incoherent that no one could follow. He had a similar tactic as Hudes in trying to derail the alien/nephilim belief. Also, he spoke so annoyingly that I am sure he was doing it on purpose to come across as a bumbling fool.

    In the end people like this have the goal of making the show look bad and poisoning the minds of the listeners. She attacked virtually everything CCR stands for while coming across as someone trying to get the truth out. Fortunately the show is christian based and gonz and basil have more discerning minds. This woman easily bamboozles ppl on shows like red ice radio and other wing nut platforms.

    I think this is a precursor of what is to come if guests aren’t vetted before being interviewed. I suggest doing a bit of due-diligence before bringing ppl on. Luckily these 2 were obvious disinfo but there are others out there much more subtle and damaging.

  17. david

    The biblical story “the sacrifice of Isaac”, Abraham’s son, could imply that Akhenaten brutally killed his son Tutankhamun. There is already established evidence that TutanKhamun was Akhenaten’s son, that Tut defied Akhenaten, was brutally killed, and that there was a following cover up.

  18. Your Brother Stephen

    Just another “New Age” satanic agent trying to mislead and attack the word of God and our Lord Jesus Christ. Ive been at this for awhile and I think I have a pretty clear picture on what has been going on and is going on in this battle. Search for the truth but dont get lost in the evil. Keep your focus on Him.

  19. Dr. Spencer??? In the words of Bob Hope in one of the best comedies ever made…Spies Like Us… “I’m glad I’m not sick!”

    And let’s remember New Agers do ultimately believe they are God or at least on the way to being Him. So from Karen’s viewpoint Basil was questioning God. Irreverent Basil. Baaaddd Basil!

  20. Rob

    Oh man. I don’t want to sound like a jerk, but it seems like I can always tell who a person really is by just the sound of their voice. At first with Karen, she starts off with that soft and musically weird “I have hidden knowledge” New Agey tone. I could tell right then that this was going to be a really difficult interview. Then as soon as you start to try and dig a little into her statements she gets hyper-defensive, makes aggressive statements without even trying to support them, and then finally plugs her ears and says “la-la-la-la-la-la” before ending the conversation.

    You guys did a really good job of staying calm and not giving ground. Much better than I would have done. I was really impressed with Basil in particular towards the end of her meltdown with the very polite, yet understandably disappointed “Thanks for your time, Karen.”
    It sounded genuine and I’m sure you were genuinely thanking her for her time. Congrats on taking the higher ground.

    Btw, I’m finally caught up on CCR episodes! Just started listening to you back in May I think and I really burned through them. They’ve been a real source of fun and joy and have really helped me through a difficult time in my life.

    God bless, guys. I hope you stick around because I’m a huge fan and consider myself, as Dr. Future put it- a Canarian.

    – Rob

  21. Great job on standing up to a very strong Jezebel spirit (can be in a woman and a guy…so no disrespect to women in general)

    “Ms Hudes, did you do your due diligence and research your sources to come to your conclusions or did you just take someone’s word for it?”

    “….then why do you expect us to just take your word for it?”

    Truth does not fear investigation.

    If you have the truth you desire people to come to it. People will ask questions in order to get to it. Taking questions as a personal attack shows a lack of maturity and humility. I think her lack of sleep could have pusher her over the edge as well.

    1. TheHolyCrow

      Michael, as I mention in a previous post, It seems that Karen not only had lack of sleep and jet lag, but her voice sounds like she was coming down with a cold or something. I have listened carefully to at least a dozen of her interviews of 1/2 hour or more, and she sounds different in this one. And, during a synagogue talk, one of her religious mates snuck up behind her and punched her in the back of her head, giving her a concussion, because he didn’t like her saying that Abraham might have been a Homo Capensis. Maybe that is what put her in a bad mood ? So let’s not be so quick to judge this VERY BRAVE lady, who also gets death threats on a regular basis from the scum of the earth. She has been immersed in this business for well over 20 years so maybe she knows a bit more than the average person ? Yes ? I think most of you owe her an apology right NOW !!!

  22. AlfaBravo

    This was the very first CCR podcast that I’ve ever listened to… wowee!!! Great job, guys. I respect your restraint and the level of respect shown for your guests. You have a *highly* informative and engaging collection of presentations between your platforms. Thank you!

  23. TheHolyCrow

    I know you guys at canary brain can see this text, just like you saw the 4 messages I sent last night in defense of Karen Hudes. Why won’t you post them ? Do you have an agenda, which is against free speech ? Maybe you are just a couple of a””holes bent on denigrating Karen ?

  24. Isabelle

    I think Karen is Dr. Ed’s handler. When you asked him to tell what he told Karen, he said it was she who told him. I think she is using his credentials to further mass deception. She is from the elite community. She could not handle intelligent questions because her stance she knows will fall apart. I would not believe a thing she says. They are a distraction. Divide and conquer.

  25. When I initially commented I clicked the “Notify me when new comments are added” checkbox and now each time a comment is added I get three emails with the same
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  26. David

    I don’t say this lightly, but it was almost as if Karen had a demon which would NOT ALLOW HER to speak about the Nephilim. She revolted so heavily against that idea, without even being able to argue her point. Like her being rejected it.

    Also, with her severe LACK of evidence for ANYTHING she was saying, I will have to agree with other commenters that she and Dr. Spencer were possibly disinformation specialists. Or at least, I think that they are so heavily bought into their own ideas, that they can’t IMAGINE any other explanation for things like the Peruvian skulls and the geology around the world that points to a global flood, and the ancient megalithic structures around the world and under the ocean.

    Yahweh is the MOST HIGH GOD. To Him be the glory. His Word is always TRUTH.

  27. wendi

    Caught this one after-the-fact,..I’m at a loss for words. Wow guys! I’m just wondering, Where on earth did you find these two??

  28. wendi

    Caught this one after-the-fact,..I’m at a loss for words. Wow guys! I’m just wondering, Where on earth did you find these two??

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  30. Mauricio

    Karen interview was professional. I was happy to listen Karen because all that information I know for long time and we can find in the Peruvian Museum and land for the non-believers.

  31. Curtis

    Many truths are out there, after all who were the pyramid culture?, Large structures known around the world inhabitants dont know who built them so its obvious inhabitants are not the builders

  32. Curtis

    I have to make another comment, For those that are extremely Eurocentric, The Beskop man( Homo Capensis) was a indigenous man from Africa with an average IQ of 150 dont panic but they are accused of being The Controllers

  33. Hey, how’s it going?

    I want to pass along some very important news that everyone needs to hear!

    In December of 2017, Donald Trump made history by recognizing Jerusalem as the captial of Israel. Why is this big news? Because by this the Jewish people of Israel are now able to press forward in bringing about the Third Temple prophesied in the Bible.

    Jewish Rabbis have publicly announced that their Messiah will be revealed in the coming years who will be a leader and spiritual guide to all nations, gathering all religions under the worship of one God. They deny Jesus as their Messiah, and the Bible tells us this Jewish Messiah will be the counterfiet that will bring about a false peace, and ultimatley the great tribulation.

    They even printed a coin to raise money for the Temple with Donald Trumps face on the front and with king Cyrus'(who built the second Temple) behind him. On the back of the coin is an image of the third Temple.

    More importantly, the power that runs the world wants to put a RFID microchip in our body making us total slaves to them. This chip matches perfectly with the Mark of the Beast in the Bible, more specifically in Revelation 13:16-18:

    “He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.”

    Referring to the last days, this could only be speaking of a cashless society, which we have yet to see, but are heading towards. Otherwise, we could still buy or sell without the mark amongst others if physical money was still currency. This Mark couldn’t be spiritual because the word references two different physical locations. If it was spiritual it would just say in the forehead. RFID microchip implant technology will be the future of a one world cashless society containing digital currency. It will be implanted in the right-hand or the forehead, and we cannot buy or sell without it! We must grow strong in Jesus. AT ALL COSTS, DO NOT TAKE IT!

    “Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name” (Revelation 14:9-11).

    People have been saying the end is coming for many years, but we needed two key things. One, the Third Temple, and two, the technology for a cashless society to fulfill the prophecy of the Mark of the Beast.

    Visit http://WWW.BIBLEFREEDOM.COM to see proof for these things and much more!

    If you haven’t already, it is time to seek God with all your heart. Jesus loves you more than you could imagine. He wants to have a relationship with you and redeem you from your sins. Turn to Him and repent while there is still hope! God bless!

  34. Tom

    Pro Homo Capensis section:
    Very, very short, poorly written, and based completely on what the Dr. happened to say in this interview with no follow-up research to get a fuller understanding of what he was saying on the phone.

    Counter arguments against homo capensis section:
    Much, much longer and much more detailed. You clearly spent a lot of time researching your counter arguments. But the problem is you didn’t research his initial points at all so you didn’t understand them well enough to even actually respond to them. Instead, you unknowingly (I hope) ended up just taking advantage of the vague nature of how he explained his points in a phone conversation. For example, you point out the lack of details in some of his points and use that as a way to cast doubt on them. No one explains every single detail of their point every time they tell someone about it on the phone. If you wanted to know more details, you could have asked him or looked them up after. But you were never interested in understanding his side so you didn’t.

    As for why Karen Hudes hung up? I completely agree with her. She said repeatedly that she was already aware of the comparisons some people make between homo capensis and Nephilim and that she disagrees with it. I feel like she told him over ten times. Yet, he kept laughing at her with arrogant laugh as if she’s acting crazy for not wanting to talk about something. She even said she doesn’t want to be associated with that concept (because she believes it’s deception). Why would an interviewer keep pushing it even after all that? That was incredibly rude for an interviewer, especially the arrogant nature of it. You wanted her time to ask *her* questions, not the other way around. She feels strongly about this topic and she doesn’t want to mess around like that.

  35. Mica

    Hi there. I tried posting several comments over the last few months. I’m wondering why they don’t ever appear? I did not say anything rude or inappropriate. It seems to me that the only reason they haven’t been approved is because I don’t agree with the author. Is that really how you want to do this? I was hoping the author had an open mind and is capable of viewing things from perspectives other than his/her own. I like a good debate where both sides have an opportunity to make their case because then I can be corrected when I’m genuinely wrong. Wouldn’t the author like to do the same?

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